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Glen and The Champs

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dee2
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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by dee2 » Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:51 am

Hey Cowpoke,

This post is only a placeholder for future discussion. You'll remember this....

The Mystery Of "Jalisco": Who Composed This Instrumental Released By The Champs?
AKA Why Does it Appear That Glen's Name As Composer Was Removed From The Release?


Glen Campbell is the credited composer on the first Challenge 59219 label (white promo) shown below.

On the second Challenge 59219 label (teal), Ernesto M. Cortázar & Manuel Esperón are the credited composers.

What may have transpired to change the record label's credits? Also, which label is "correct"?

The Champs-Jalisco-a.jpg
The Champs-Jalisco-a.jpg (70.48 KiB) Viewed 249 times

The Champs_Jalisco.png
The Champs_Jalisco.png (462.87 KiB) Viewed 249 times

One consideration: a Mexican ranchera song titled "¡Ay, Jalisco, no te rajes!" was composed by Manuel Esperón with lyrics by Ernesto Cortázar Sr. in 1941. The song was featured in the Mexican film ¡Ay Jalisco, no te rajes!, also in 1941. It became a huge hit in Mexico and was followed by many covers including one used in a Disney film (same melody, different lyrics). The melody of this song is the same basic instrumental melody on The Champs' promo/record releases.

Cowpoke, you had previously mentioned to me in a side conversation that sometimes one can claim copyrights for new arrangements of classic songs (in the public domain?) and that Glen may have done so forJalisco assuming he had written a new arrangement of the classic for The Champs.

Still, it is puzzling, isn't it, about the different credits on the labels? The promo would have been distributed first, of course. I wonder if Glen's name appears on any non-promo Challenge pressings? (I found an Apex record that credits Glen Campbell.)

Ar had previously posted (thanks Ar!) that The Champs' Jalisco with Glen on rhythm guitar was released in 1963. Since Glen had signed on Capitol Records in 1962, would he have been restricted from releasing any work under his name on a different recording company's label such as Gene Autry's Challenge label?

If Glen had been restricted due to a signing restriction, then perhaps Challenge had to remove Glen's credit from their label?

Isn't it odd that both Mexican artists' names replaced Glen's name on The Champs' instrumental cover? Manuel Esperón composed the melody that inspired The Champs' instrumental. The Champs' cover used no lyrics yet Ernesto Cortázar's name is on the record label too.

One can watch a clip of ¡Ay Jalisco, no te rajes! performed by Jorge Negret in the 1941 film here:



and

Listen to The Champs' cover (Glen Campbell composer & on rhythm guitar) here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Z-XwBlndpE


¡Ay, caramba! Regardless of the label change backstory / mystery, isn't Glen's arrangement for The Champs' cover brilliant? His masterful guitar playing carries the piece, too, in my opinion.

__________
D. Zink c. 2018 for Glen Campbell Forums



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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Cowpoke » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:41 am

And here's another little piece of the puzzle! I was finally able to find out when exactly Glen first saw the Champs and Jerry Fuller. An important moment because Jerry Fuller was one of people who convinced Glen to head for LA. It was also Jerry who told, in an interview a few years ago, that he and The Champs were on a package tour with other acts (like Jimmy Clanton, The Crests and Frankie Ford) when he first met Glen. That made it possible to look for the exact date, going through old newspaper archives. Well... it turns out that Glen went to see them at the Civic Auditorium on his birthday, April 22nd 1960, when he had just turned 24!

1960-04-22_.jpg
April 22 1960
1960-04-22_.jpg (150.94 KiB) Viewed 833 times

Which makes sense... most of the nights Glen would have be performing himself of course, at The Hitching Post in Albuquerque. But on his birthday he took the night off, which eventually paid off... in a big way.


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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Cowpoke » Sat Sep 16, 2017 5:07 am

Finally a tiny bit of progress on the question if Glen played that terrific guitar solo on "Suicide" / "Panic Button" recorded July 6, 1960 at Norman Petty Studios in Clovis, NM. I contacted Shawn Nagy of http://www.superoldies.com who made a listing of recording sessions at Norman Petty Studios. The Champs are listed here: http://www.superoldies.com/norvajak/c-d.html. Shawn told me this:
I had located long ago an interview with Seals & Crofts mentioning their session there and that they had “picked Glen up on the way through”.
Sadly he doesn't have that interview anymore and yes, it's not hard evidence, but still, it would fit in perfectly with the scenario that I had in mind: Glen had met The Champs a few months before when Glen visited a Champs concert in ALBQ and when The Champs toured New Mexico again in the summer of 1960 they picked him up on the way to the recording studio.

Now if I only could find that interview with Seals & Crofts... :) In any case, many thanks to Shawn Nagy for this information!


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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Cowpoke » Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:01 am

Wow Randy. That video is much better. Impossible to sit still when watching that one. Thanks!


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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Randy » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:10 pm

Here's another video of buzzsaw twist that shows the record label Cowpoke. Remember as it says at the end of the video to "twist at your own risk"
:D

https://youtu.be/l1bjjDtdx2Y?t=113



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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Cowpoke » Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:32 pm

The next single The Champs released was "Tequila Twist"/"Limbo Rock" (Challenge 9131), recorded on November 16, 1961 and released in December of that year. As r&r expert Dik de Heer writes on his website "In the Can" (http://members.home.nl/henk.gorter/Itc6111.html) Tequila Twist was the original A-side and spent one week at number 99 on the Billboard Hot 100. However, the b-side proved to be the more popular track, hitting number 40 eventually. Now I know that Glen himself has said many times that he played on "Limbo Rock" but alas, the session contract says otherwise. The session led by arranger Jimmie Haskell featured some legendary Wrecking Crew names, like Tommy Tedesco (guitar), Earl Palmer (drums), Jim Gordon (percussion) and Plas Johnson (saxophone). But Glen is nowhere to be found! :? (BTW, Bob Morris on bass is the only Champs member playing on this session).
the-champs-limbo-rock-challenge_300px.jpg
The Champs - Tequila Twist / Limbo Rock (Challenge 9131)
the-champs-limbo-rock-challenge_300px.jpg (92.08 KiB) Viewed 1176 times
Now if I were to make an educated guess what Glen was doing at that particular day I would say he might have been performing at The Crossbow Inn in Van Nuys, California. From September 1961 until November 1961 Glen was a regular performer there together with some former bandmates from... The Champs! (Which bandmates? According to this Facebook page, they were Jerry Cole, Dash Crofts and Jimmy Seals, which makes sense to me)
test.png
Glenn Campbell and the Gee Cees at the Crossbow Inn in Van Nuys, Van Nuys Valley News, November 3, 1961
test.png (41.64 KiB) Viewed 1176 times
They went by the name of "The Gee Cees" and they released a single called Buzz Saw (Twist) (Crest 1088) in October of that year (Billboard review October 30, 1961). Sadly their popularity as a club band didn't translate into a hit on the charts and Buzz Saw Twist remains Glen's only stab at a bonafide instrumental rock 'n' roll hit.



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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Cowpoke » Tue Jun 09, 2015 1:58 am

Dee, in a way it is like iTunes. You can purchase and download songs. The big difference of course is that you can listen to songs in their entirety, without actually downloading them. So it's a streaming service above anything else. There are several subscription types. For unlimited, ad-free access you will have to get a paid Premium subscription, but there are also less expensive and free alternatives that Spotify offers.

I really like it. For example, it allows me to get to know The Champs' (almost) complete discography without having to buy all their albums.

When you download an album you also download a front cover image. In most cases however, there are no liner notes available. For The Champs, just about every month a new compilation album is released, with a variation of the same tracks. (And yes, some of them have used this same photo of Glen with The Champs on the frontcover.) The same goes for Glen Campbell by the way, you wouldn't believe how many Spotify albums you can make with just the tracks of "Big Bluegrass Special"! :D


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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Dee » Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:26 pm

What an amazing coincidence!

Cowpoke, is Spotify like iTunes? You purchase and then download the songs/album? Do liner notes and an image of the album cover come with the album download?

Would this Champs album cover be the first to show Glen with other members of The Champs?

I hope to see a CD version of this digital album!

Dee



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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Cowpoke » Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:20 am

Hi Dee,
thanks for your reply! I think that website took their information from the same CD booklet as I did. But, I wil contact them to ask. Funny enough, today another compilation album by The Champs was released on Spotify.

https://open.spotify.com/album/4Fz2M8FbvG3lw0mZphJqM5" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It has Glen on the front cover
front_champs.jpg
The Champs - All Time Instrumental Greats (2015)
front_champs.jpg (104.26 KiB) Viewed 1849 times
and it contains "Panic Button"! :D


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Re: Glen and The Champs

Post by Dee » Sun Jun 07, 2015 8:34 pm

I appreciate this topic, Cowpoke! Thank you for reconstructing Glen's involvement with The Champs and recordings that he played (or didn't play) on.

A Petty Studio Productions website shows a date that confirms Panic Button was recorded in very early July, 1960 (this site is off by a couple of days). I am confused by how this site uses dates. What do you think about it? You likely uncovered this site when you were researching PSP.

For Panic Button, 7/4/1960 is shown, but not described as "unreleased" or "released". I assume this is the session date and Glen could have been on this session after meeting up with The Champs a few months earlier. Big assumption: Glen might have been filling in for one of group members on this particular session.
See: http://www.superoldies.com/pettystudios/a-f.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (control-F and use search word "champs" to find this record).

At the top of this webpage is info that might be of help with regard to the missing session information in PSP's files:
Petty productions not issued in the USA are noted.
Some of these may have just used Petty's publishing concerns, but were recorded elsewhere.

Dates are based on disc reviews and label information by [month / day / year].

Master number(s) are used for identifying records with no assigned number.
Reference to unissued material is drawn from articles, liner notes, surviving acetates or direct from the artist.
There could be other discs by virtually all the artists listed.
Just my two cents: I believe the guitar playing on "Panic Button" has a young Glen Campbell "Buzz Saw" / "Buzz Saw Twist" sound.



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